Friday, August 14, 2009

Family Civil War Part 2

Bro wrote:

If the Health Care issue never arouse, you wouldn't be arguing with mom. And you know what really ticks her off more than anything...abortion. 67 million kids have been murdered since the mid sixties in the US alone. Now that's an issue we should be debating. Death has already happened. Without a National Health care plan, we're assuming many will be lost. Are people dying or suffering now any more than they did in the past? There has never been a national health care plan.

It all comes down to an extended life issue, whether it's health care or the abortion issue, the economy we're all fighting for an extended life for ourselves and our loved ones and those we know that suffer. If the National Health care plan passes, does that guarantee that you'll live longer than you will without it, or anyone live longer. How do you know how long people will live, with or without health care, do you have ESPN. Many people with good health care die every day, I see it at the hosp. So how many more will live longer than they would anyway without health care. AM not saying that health care isn't necessary, it is. But so is family, exercise, working, trusting God, etc.

Do you seriously think that Conservatives and Christians want people to die? Just because they don't believe the health care plan pushed by Obama agrees with their interest. That's sad if you do. I don't want people to die or suffer, even though I'm not excited about a national health care plan.

We need to stop angering each other over any issue, debate and discussion o.k., but not hate. I certainly don't hate you or am I angry about what you say or do. I can certainly tell in your emails that you seem to hate people for not agreeing with you. What happened to democracy, what happen to love.

You want to be able to disagree vehemently with many, but get mad and attack the ones that disagree with you.

We all need to step back and put love first.

Love ya Bro.


I Replied:

Cheap Tactic calling me a "hater". (editorial comment)


I love ya but I have to tell you and mom that you are wrong. I don't even think it is so much the health care issue as it is the national debt. I believe that decent people want others to be able to get medical care, but they worry about the country going broke. We bailed the bankers for three times the 10 year cost of this reform cited (erroneously I think) by the worst case scenario of the critics. They don't cite the anticipated cost increases if nothing is done, which far exceed the reform model with its cost containment measures.

If 22,000 unnecessary deaths a year doesn't affect your thinking about things how can you defend being pro-life? Shouldn't we all be fired up about that? The infant mortality rate would be much higher if not for Federal Medicaid and WIC, both of which would be called "socialism" by these same critics (as would Medicare). I haven't heard the same critics calling for an end to these programs, which they should if they were logically consistent, but they know nobody would listen to them then.

Babies of uninsured mothers are at higher risk of infant mortality. Even after controlling for important explanatory factors like age, income, and health and
pregnancy history, babies born to low-income uninsured mothers are 60 percent more
likely to die in the first month after birth.


The U.S. has a higher infant mortality rate than all other developed countries. source:

How Does Being Uninsured Harm Individuals and Families?

* Studies estimate that the number of excess deaths among uninsured adults age 25-64 is in the range of 22,000 a year. This mortality figure is more than the number of deaths from diabetes (17,500) within the same age group.8
* Lack of insurance compromises the health of the uninsured because they receive less preventive care, they are diagnosed at more advanced disease stages, and once diagnosed, tend to receive less therapeutic care and have higher mortality rates than insured individuals.9
* Controlling for age, race, sex, and income, uninsured cancer patients are 1.6 times more likely than insured patients to die within five years of diagnosis. 10
* The high cost of health care can damage the overall economic well-being of families. One in three low-income parents without coverage report medical bills have a major financial impact on their families.11
* On average, the uninsured are 9 to 10 times more likely to forgo medical care because of cost and twice as likely to have medical debt. 9
* The uninsured are increasingly paying “up front” -- before services will be rendered. When they are unable to pay the full medical bill in cash at the time of service, they can be turned away except in life-threatening circumstances.12
* Access to an emergency room for uninsured patients does not qualify as access to coordinated care. While physicians are required to stabilize patients in an emergency, they are not required to treat the condition comprehensively. 13
* Over the last decade, disparities between the uninsured and insured widened in access to a usual source of care, annual check-ups, and preventive care, and are the greatest in disparities and our growing.

1 comment:

  1. It is amazing to me the amount of fear that has been brewed by people with financial incentive to kill the health plan. Unfortunately they are lieing to well-meaning, individuals who have become part of a hysteria that feeds on itself. The media loves it. Screaming citizens increase the ratings (how many TV programs are sponsored by big Pharma?" Remember the day care abuse hysteria from years past? People believed that satanist were using Day Cares to abuse children. Innocent people went to jail.We were also lead down the garden-path during the build up to the war in Iraq. There were no weapons of mass destruction and while some in that administration sincerely believed there were, others were cynically using post-911 fear to ramp up a war to settle old debts and make big profits. I have found that when one side is using scare tactics and appealing to people's fears, that that side must be carefully scrutinized. Hitler said (para-phrase) that people will believe a big lie more than a little one. I think that this is a case of "the big lie" on the part of those manipulating the anti-national health care movement. My husband and I both have good health care plans at work. So do our children and their spouses. The cost to us has gone up over the years, I doubt if any legislation will be passed that will lower that cost, either in premiums or taxes. But, I will not be faced with the catastrophe of losing my insurance if I change or lose my job (cobra only lasts so long and can be very expensive) I will know that if I am struck by a terrible illness and can't work,that my premiums can not be raised to a level I can not pay. Lastly,I will not be faced with an endless stream of people who either can not afford health care for their families and must depend on the generosity of others to raise money for treatment, or who do without until they die or qualify for medicaid, often with an exacerbated condition. If you think depending on the generosity of religious institutions to take care of the needs of the poor is the answer, please read "Angela's Ashes", and it's description of how that system worked in England before they developed their health care plan.
    Are there people in this country who favor allowing people the option of actively ending their own life? Yes, and I am opposed to it, just as I am opposed to euthanasia and would like to see restrictions on abortion. But that is not what this bill is about or what it proposes. Would the AARP support such a bill? I doubt it!
    yes, I have faith in God. But I still go to work so I can eat and afford a place to live. I demand that my food and water be inspected for contamination before I eat or drink it and while I always say a prayer before my flight takes off, I also depend on the Talents and dedication of the people caring for the plane and inspecting it to keep me safe, and I give to charity, especially those that help people help themselves (Jesus did not magically produce fish to feed the multitudes, he relied on the fish that was already present to miraculously satisfy the crowd. Nor did he take a dry jar and produce wine, he used the available water for that.) God does not expect us to be passive, he expects us to care for one another (all people, not just the Christian or the Jew) I depend on God for forgiveness and for caring for me and others in situations in which I have no control. In situations where I can influence the outcome, I pray for wisdom and courage and recognize that I may be wrong. Too often people of faith use that faith as a disguise for arrogance and an excuse to justify their own fears and prejudice. Historically, and even today, religious certainty has been used to defend the murder of millions as well as their enslavement. Let's not use it as a justification for denying health care to our fellow Americans.